Gopaul said he does not know where Mchunu got his number.
KwaZulu-Natal acting deputy provincial commissioner for crime detection, Anthony Gopaul, has questioned suspended Police Minister Senzo Mchunu’s direct call to him without provincial commissioner Nhlanhla Mkhwanazi’s knowledge.
Gopaul was the first witness at the Madlanga commission after it returned from recess on Monday.
He said Mchunu contacted him for the first time on 5 February 2025 to inquire about the murder of Mandeni Local Municipality ward councillor, Phendukani Mabhida.
Mabhida was attacked by unknown gunmen at his home in KwaSithebe Township.
“I did not recognise the voice at the time, nor did I have the minister’s phone number stored on my phone. I did brief the minister and told him what actually transpired. He told me I must keep him informed about the investigation. I said to the minister that I was not investigating the murder, although it happened in my district at the time. The murder was being investigated by the political killings task team,” Gopaul explained.
“The minister then asked me why they were investigating the case. ‘I had instructed that these cases be investigated at the police station where the crime occurred,'” Mchunu said.
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“I tried to explain to the minister that when it comes to political killings, the team that is investigating these murders is better equipped and trained to understand the modus operandi of how these murders take place, who the hitmen are who were contacted.
“They can do a better linkage, because, if a police station can investigate a case here, it wouldn’t know how it is linked to another murder in another police station across the province. It made better sense to apply that kind of centralisation of the dockets for these investigations. Mchunu did not respond.”
‘Inappropriate’
Gopaul said he only became aware of the issues around Mchunu and the PKTT after watching the portfolio committee on police, in which Mkhwanazi lamented the minister’s conduct.
“At the provincial level, this was not a topic for us,” he said.
He said he did not know where the minister got his number, but still obliged with Mchunu’s request for information on the case.
“Later the same day, I WhatsApped the minister with an update because I had received some information regarding possible suspects.”
Protocol
However, he still followed the Saps protocol of informing his principal if he had been in communication with an individual outside their chain of command.
“After speaking to the minister, I called the provincial commissioner. How protocol within the Saps is, is that you have a chain of command and you follow it. You are appointed in terms of that chain of command.
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“So, when someone outside of your protocol communicates with you, you will have to inform your principal. I called the commissioner and informed him of my phone conversation with the minister.
“He asked me why the minister called me. I told him I don’t have a personal relationship with the minister and that I didn’t know how he got my number. It was my first time receiving a call from any minister.
“From my protocol training, it is not appropriate for a minister to contact me, but I can’t say from the minister’s protocol as a politician, what training they received on how to communicate and with whom and to what boundaries they are allowed to cross.
“Purely from my training, it is not normal and in accordance with our protocol for me to interact with the minister without the specific direction of my principal.”
He said he suspected Mchunu’s interest in the case stemmed from Mabhida’s ANC membership.
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