Malema slammed the minister for insisting on playing a recording he had not listened to himself.
Parliament’s ad hoc committee is proceeding with the conclusion that the recording of KwaZulu-Natal (KZN) police commissioner Nhlanhla Mkhwanazi allegedly threatening Police Minister Senzo Mchunu does not exist.
This comes after Mchunu last week accused Mkhwanazi of making threats in response to his decision to dismantle the political killings task team (PKTT).
Mchunu made another appearance before the committee on Tuesday, where MPs grilled him on his 31 December 2024 directive to disband the PKTT and the recording of a phone call between Mkhwanazi and his chief of staff, Cedric Nkabinde.
Mchunu’s immediately vs Ramaphosa’s immediately
ANC MP Thokozile Sokanyile told the minister that the timing of his directive to disband the PKTT was questionable, provided that national police commissioner Fannie Masemola was on leave at the time.
“When I look at that correspondence and its timing, I can say that it was contentious, given that you were aware that the national commissioner was on leave. You didn’t even brief the national commissioner on your intentions to disband the PKTT. It even had that ‘immediate effect’ on it, hence I’m saying it was contentious,” said Sokanyile.
In the height of the Covid-19 pandemic, President Cyril Ramaphosa would address the nation, where he would announce the immediate implementation of a lockdown. Mchunu explained that his “immediately” should not be confused with Ramaphosa’s.
“Immediate effect should never be read outside of the reference to the preliminary report [on 20 January 2025] and other meetings because it will be out of context. There was a clear indication that there would be engagements in the future,” explained Mchunu.
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“There was nothing wrong with the timing from where I’m sitting because I wanted a situation where, at the beginning of the year, we would have something concrete and clearly identified that it was something I wanted to get rid of immediately, amid all other issues.”
Mchunu further explained that when he saw the commissioner at a funeral on 28 December 2024, he had “no solid idea” how to engage with him on the disbandment.
“It was only after relaxing at home that everything shaped up in my mind,” he said.
Mchunu and the recording
Last week, Mchunu instructed parliament to play an audio recording that he believed would prove Mkhwanazi’s anger over the PKTT disbandment to the point where he allegedly threatened the minister.
That was not the case.
MPs grilled him on Tuesday, with EFF MP Julius Malema slamming the minister for playing a recording he had not listened to himself.
“The minister does not have the recording he told us about. He wanted us to listen to something he never listened to himself because it’s not there. We don’t have a recording; that recording doesn’t exist,” said Malema.
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“Let’s agree that there is no such recording where General Mkhwanazi threatened the minister. We must put it on record that the minister does not have that recording, and therefore, that recording doesn’t exist.”
Mchunu explained that his chief of staff had informed him that Mkhwanazi was “very angry” and that he had made threatening comments in their previous conversations.
‘It doesn’t exist’
However, during the conversation that Mchunu had instructed Nkabinde to record, it appears Mkhwanazi had calmed down and did not repeat the alleged threats.
“He [Nkabinde] said they had spoken before, where the threat was that ‘if Mchunu believes he’s clean, he should proceed [with the disbandment]’ and hence the request to record. The part that I was interested in was where such a statement was made and then recorded,” explained Mchunu.
“Now, it’s only in reference, it turns out, because that part was said before they started recording, but it is referred to in the following conversations. I thought that it had been recorded, but it turns out it had not been recorded and comes up as a reference.”
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Mchunu suggested bringing Nkabinde to come and testify about the threats.
“As it stands now, the ad hoc committee does not have the extract where threats are made, as you promised would be made available,” said Malema.
‘Save us!’
Mk party MPs also slammed the minister for insisting on going on and on when responding to questions instead of getting straight to the point.
“Please protect us, chair. The minister has a tendency of wanting to try to show us how clever he is. He is behaving like Jonah [instead of going to Ninevah, he goes to Tarshish with his answers]. This takes time, so he should refrain from showing us how clever he is,” said MKP MP Vusi Shongwe.
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